How to Watch Master Therapists in Session and Build Clinical Competence

Taking Stock of Professional Development

Later life, as gerontological researcher William Randall writes, is a time for looking inward and outward as well as forward and backward. And as much as I don’t always like to acknowledge it, I am in later life. Having mysteriously and involuntarily arrived at that juncture, I find myself simultaneously shedding and accumulating; material possessions in the case of the former, and wisdom in the case of the latter. I am indeed looking forward, perhaps not yet as enthusiastically as I would like, but certainly looking backward to assess what about who I am both personally and professionally I would like to carry with me on this next leg.

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I’ll save the “personal” for a future essay and will focus here on the professional — specifically, my evolution as a psychotherapist. Having recently retired from my full-time position as a clinical educator, I am still in the classroom, and as I wrote in a previous blog, still training future therapists. And a significant portion of that classroom work has revolved around the use of clinical training videos that we (Psychotherapy.net) produce. As a caveat, I want you to know that I used these videos long before I signed on as the Editor six years ago.

Over the years as a psychotherapist, I have had face-to-face clinical supervision, read my share of clinical books, have “performed” in front of the one-way mirror, consulted with peers on case management, and even written for the therapy audience. But it has always been clinical videos that have not only rounded out but deepened my clinical skills. So, I thought it might be useful to share some of my favorites, those on whose production I have been involved, and those whose entry into our vast collection predated my arrival on the shores of Psychotherapy.net.

Watching Experts Work with Clients

I will shamelessly (mis)appropriate the famous movie line by saying, “You had me at Irvin Yalom.” Aside from the incredible trove of his clinical writings, Yalom has shared his many individual and group therapy skills in front of the camera. His insightful work and clinical acumen have been for me and my trainees — although I suspect for many others — what the likes of Carl Rogers’ work has been for current and past generations of clinicians.

I have done a fair amount of clinical interviewing and assessment over the years in a wide range of venues with a broad range of clients: prisons, hospitals, psychiatric facilities, private practice, and in the forensic arena. As we would likely all agree, good interviewing requires both art and skill, and I have thoroughly enjoyed and learned from the diagnostic interviews of Jason Buckles, who has deepened my understanding of the kind of questions that must be asked to differentiate among many and often overlapping and conflicting diagnoses — substance abuse, personality disorder, and mood disturbance to name a few.

Good assessment, however, requires not only diagnostic facility, but a foundation in interpersonal and interviewing skills that transcend specific pathologies. And to enhance my own interviewing skills, I often turned to the work of John and Rita Sommers Flannagan, who have reminded me how to incorporate mental status, biopsychosocial, and clinical questioning into the interview process. I have also continuously relied on John’s work around suicide assessment and intervention with clients ranging in age, ethnicity, and life circumstance.

As my own clinical practice has evolved over the years, I have been exposed to — or perhaps I should say, I have exposed myself to — clients whose circumstances, culture, and values have differed widely from my own. I have embraced the personal and professional awakening that comes with looking beyond my own relatively small sphere of experience so that I could appreciate the lives of others whose paths have been so different from my own.

Watching Sue Johnson wield her velvet EFT (Emotionally Focused Therapy) sword to cut through the resistance and defenses of couples has given me the confidence to work with couples. But our EFT Masterclass, a four-volume series in which EFT is demonstrated by a team of EFT experts, has been especially enlightening. It has helped build my confidence and courage to venture into challenging couples counseling arenas like pornography addiction, grief and loss, and sexual issues.

***


Certainly, I could go on extolling the virtues of our clinical training videos, but what has been useful to me as a clinician may not be so for you. You may not be drawn to the work of these particular clinicians. But certainly, there are enough training videos in our collection to satisfy all tastes. And there are many ways to learn. You may learn best by reading or doing. Some of you may hold to the belief that 10,000 hours of doing makes for expertise. But if you have the space and desire to invite the masters along on your clinical journey and enjoy watching them at work, grab a front-row seat and tune in.


 

Questions for Thought and Discussion

How do you resonate with the premise of this essay?

What training videos have you found useful in your own professional development?

What challenges have you experienced in using clinical training videos?   

Radical Listening: A Key to Therapeutic Success

The space between musical notes is called an interval, I just learned. French composer Claude Debussy described music as “the space between the notes.” Without the space between, it would just be a cacophony of noise. The space allows for the notes to resonate and reverberate and mature into their fullness of expression. It gives room for relativity and reflection and response. This analogy could be applied to many things in life to improve their experience and outcome: dialogue, relationships, life, and psychotherapy.

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Being untrained in the art and technicalities of music, I listen to and appreciate music more intuitively. I hear the Gestalt of the composition or song rather than attempting to discern the nuance of their parts. Knowing this about music, and then extending it analogously to other areas of life, clarifies and shines a light on the “space between” in some illuminating ways.

Competing for Space in Relationships

Sometimes in relationship conflict, when two people are vying for space to be heard, there are times when there is little space for absorption, reflection, and appreciation of the other. Defensiveness and/or attack predominate. Or sometimes one person needs space and the other does not provide it, pursuing relentlessly, forcing the other into either complete retreat and shutdown, or drawing them reluctantly into defensive engagement. It is a simultaneous and continual banging of pots and pans and blasting of horns with no space in between.

In this particularly heated kind of context, creating “space between” facilitates relative quiet and calm. It allows for reflection time. It provides the opportunity to digest the other’s words, and for words of retort to be more considered and chosen. It gives feelings time to catch up. It allows each to be heard and seen. For the uninitiated or unaccustomed, to break through requires the practice of self-reflection and awareness raising. It also requires getting in touch with one’s bodily sensations to change the state of one’s nervous system. The space between — the intervals — needs to be conscientiously placed in between the notes, just as in the writing of a piece of music, like the unfolding of an experimental jazz set.

Sexual Abuse and the Need to be Heard

I was inspired to think about the space between in a relatively new job I am working in. It is in a community legal clinic providing counselling support to adult survivors of sexual abuse. For many of these clients, it is the first time they have spoken about their childhood abuse, particularly in any detail. They trust us, the intake team, counsellors and lawyers, especially considering most of our work is done on the telephone. In most cases, clients and staff never even meet face to face.

Being in this new role and working within a new modality for me (telephone-based counselling), I have been in observer mode, taking in the similarities and differences to my previous counselling roles and clientele. I noticed a tendency in some clients to talk ceaselessly and seemingly uninterruptedly for the full hour, quite easily and without allowing anything much in return from me. I can sometimes barely get a word in edgeways. How dare they! Are they not aware of the wisdom and insight they are missing out on? Did they not come here for my well-honed techniques of reflection and Socratic enquiry? My gifts are going to waste! I am not here to just listen! Besides, I have got a wealth of experiential Gestalt learnings to practice (I am currently a student of this art).

After composing myself, I realized that this was exactly what they needed right now. I had to adjust. They needed to be heard. Needed to be seen. To be believed. Some clients did not have any meaningful contact, let alone any contact at all, with another person in the space between our phone calls. Many have very deeply entrenched fears around trust and relational intimacy. It was their time. I had to adjust. I needed to be the one to provide the space between.

I am there to just listen. And this is a powerful ally for many for where they are right now. I continually receive feedback from clients about how grateful they are and how important it is for them just to be listened to. To be acknowledged. To be given space, just for them. It is sometimes difficult to accept and implement. Nevertheless, my greatest wisdom is to just be minimal. Not always, of course, but to know when and how.

The Power of Space in Group Therapy

I recently participated in an experiential group facilitation workshop. It was taught by an extensively experienced Gestalt and Psychodrama practitioner. It was a profound learning opportunity for me, the standout technique which I observed being “space”. I was like Ludwig van Beethoven, I imagine, witnessing…hmmm, I don’t know…help me out here Google…Herbert von Karajan conducting Bizet’s Carmen? Sure, why not? The space the facilitator provided to the group, to those doing a piece of work, was enlightening to observe. The empty space they allowed for the subject and other participants to sit with their feelings, their uncertainty, the potential void, without jumping in to fill the space or to offer insight or comfort, seemed so natural. But it was not natural. Well, not for me. They seemed to know exactly when to allow another group member to break the silence and when to pause them, when to slow things down. It impacted me deeply. It inspired me to be a better space maker in my work. For, while in this group, I was imagining what I might have said during moments of others work, how I would have broken the silences possibly out of anxiety or impatience or those egotistical impulses that often lurk just beneath the surface. I was moved by the experience, emotionally and practically, for a few reasons. It led group participants into new ways of experiencing ourselves, giving more room for us to feel into the phenomenological moment, and because it once again revealed to me a learning edge of mine, shining a light on another way of being with clients. With people. And with myself.

***

The space between is a fertile ground. I have noticed that when I do not allow for space in between life activities, my world becomes a cacophony of noise. It is less beautiful. And there is less space to understand myself, my feelings, my impulses, or for insights to emerge. I miss out on flowing with the natural rhythm of life, the hidden laws of being perhaps. Part of my development is to extend this ‘space between’ to more areas of my life — counselling to be specific. To increasingly get myself out of the way, and to tune in better to the needs of the moment, to the needs of my client.   

Victor Yalom on Psychotherapy and the Pursuit of Mastery

Keeping Current

Lawrence Rubin: Dr. Yalom, you are the founder of Psychotherapy.net so by definition, an entrepreneur. But as your Editor, I also know you to be a self-taught tinkerer, craftsman, and artist, as well as a practicing psychotherapist. While I’d like to touch on each of these facets in our conversation, please tell us first what are you working on now?
Victor Yalom: Well, I am always working on many things at the same time. I don't know if that's due to an inability to focus on one thing or just that I have multiple interests and duties running this small enterprise of Psychotherapy.net. 

We're always thinking of ways to provide content in a form that is useful to therapists practicing in the field as well as adapting to current times
One of my focuses after 27 or so years of recording who I consider to be the greats in our field and making training videos, is finally stepping up to the plate and doing some recordings of my own work as a therapist. Just yesterday, I recorded a case consultation group that I led online. This should result in one or more online courses in which I will be teaching some core skills in therapy that I have learned from my mentors as well as from my clients. So, that's very exciting. 
 

In addition, we at Psychotherapy.net are always scouting out and finding experts to be featured in videos. We have a new video coming out on Emotionally Focused Therapy and another on online crisis counseling. We're always thinking of ways to provide content in a form that is useful to therapists practicing in the field as well as adapting to current times. We realize that while people have grown accustomed to receiving video content in shorter bursts, we haven't quite reduced ours to the 15-second clips of TikTok. However, we are producing, for example, a shorter series called Mastery in Minutes that are up to 30 minutes long where we're trying to present core ideas or skills to therapists.

LR: Now that you’ve made this transition from interviewing experts in the psychotherapy field to being videotaped while you personally do psychotherapy, do you see yourself at this stage in your therapeutic career as an expert?
VY:
doubt and uncertainty are inherent in our work
I do feel that after practicing for almost 40 years now, I've acquired some valuable skills that I think are important to pass on that are not commonly being taught by others. It's an evolution because I think like most therapists, even experienced ones, that there's so much ambiguity in our work that a lot of the time I feel like, gee, I'm not sure what I’m doing. Would X or Y expert think that I’ve studied enough to be doing this? What will other colleagues think? How will the establishment of experts, or those who are practicing evidence-based techniques or teaching them in universities view this?

So, those are some of my doubts. But then the other side is that doubt and uncertainty are inherent in our work. I don't think it's a realistic or even desirable idea that we should reach a state of certainty about our work, but perhaps more comfort with our doubts and our questioning, and our realization that therapy is an ambiguous and creative enterprise.  
LR: I hope that the younger therapists who read this interview will embrace this idea that certainty is elusive, and therapy works but sometimes for reasons that are simply outside of our understanding. I understand that you've also been doing work with foreign distributors so I'm wondering what that looks like and what are some of the challenges?
VY: To a great degree, we've been trying to take the valuable, rich library that we've created over the last 27 years and make it as widely available as possible. It started very slowly at first with VHS tapes and then DVDs, but once we got into streaming, it was a lot easier to get it out there widely and internationally.

a lot of businesses have pulled out from Russia, but it's not something I've struggled with too much because the therapists there want to learn
But obviously, not everyone speaks English, so we've partnered with some businesses and organizations overseas to translate our videos and make them available. We have distributors in China, Italy, Greece, Russia, and a couple other countries. Typically, they've simply translated our videos with subtitles, but the Russians have been dubbing them using voice actors as well and so it's pretty simple in that sense, but there are unique challenges.

Our Russian distributors, not surprisingly, are having incredible challenges given the war and the boycotts. We were speaking with them yesterday and they’re actually moving to Georgia, the country, not the state, and we're finding ways to advertise, get payments, have money transferred to Georgia, and then sent here. At least that's the plan.

And with that, there's the potential ethical concern. Obviously, a lot of businesses have pulled out from Russia, but it's not something I've struggled with too much because the therapists there want to learn. They’re certainly not responsible for Putin's madness and butchery. I feel pretty clear that if we can find a way to continue to offer our videos to Russian therapists, that's a good thing.  
LR: That's interesting. I was going to ask you about possible ethical concerns and conflicts, but when you couch it in the context of therapists, whether in Russia or China still want to learn, you are providing a needed service. The therapeutic skills that these therapists will learn because of our association with them will help the citizens of these countries who have access to therapy. I don't know how widely accessible therapy is, however.
VY: Right. It reminds me several years ago, we had an inquiry from some Iranian therapists who wanted to publish our videos there. Let's just be upfront, in smaller countries like that, it’s not really about making significant profit. They’re relatively small markets. But it’s more just wanting what we’ve done to be viewed and used in training therapists. It turns out they were on the list of nations that the US does not look favorably upon. We finally figured out how to apply to the US State Department to get permission to have our videos translated and sold in Iran. But, after about a year and a half, we got a one-page letter that said, “Sorry, no!”
LR: It’s interesting with regard to Russia and Ukraine and the Middle East, that some of the contributors to our websites, some of the folks who write blogs and articles are doing so from those places about some of the challenges of delivering therapeutic services to people who are directly impacted by the war and related political tensions. So, I can see the benefit of partnerships with some of these entities. I also see the ethical concerns. Are there any other challenges when translating therapy into different languages considering that much that occurs in the therapy space is non-verbal? 
VY:
in Russia, they're using voice actors to dub our videos, apparently because that's quite common there as well as in other countries
As I said, in Russia, they're using voice actors to dub our videos, apparently because that's quite common there as well as in other countries. I was concerned about that. It’s so important and that's one of the reasons I started producing videos in the first place—to capture the non-content information, like body language, facial expression, tone of voice, inflection, and all that. I was concerned that a lot might be lost or missed. However, they've assured me that their actors are capable to a remarkable degree of mirroring that of the recording. Since I don’t speak Russian, I’ve got to take their word for it that they’ve done a good job. But they typically offer both, the option to listen to the dubbed version and/or subtitles.

Well, if it's a good translation, then it should work and that's not my area of expertise but just a little example. I recall looking at one of the transcripts initially done in China many years ago be one of our distributors. They were translating some discussion with my former teacher and mentor, James Bugental, who was referring to growing up in the Great Depression and the ways that impacted him in terms of his attitude towards money. It was quite a traumatic thing for that generation.

I came across the transcript, and I don't recall how I did it, because I don't speak Chinese, but somehow I became aware that they referred to the Great Depression, the historical event, as major depression, the psychiatric diagnosis. So, you have to have good translators. Language is very nuanced.

With our Chinese distributor, they're used to presenting videos in more of a weekly webinar format, so they've taken our videos and chopped them up into 30-minute segments that they offer once a week. They’ve wanted to add some live Q&A to some of our videos. For example, we have a popular course with my father, Irvin Yalom, “The Art of Psychotherapy,” and I've done some live Q&A even though I’m not him. I know the content well, so I’ve been able to answer some questions from the Chinese students that hopefully helps make it more understandable to them.  

How I Built This

LR: All meaningful ventures such as creating Psychotherapy.net have an origin story, so I think our readers would be interested to know yours.
VY:
I had the chance to study in-depth with James Bugental, who was a real master psychologist, psychotherapist, and teacher
After I completed my doctorate in psychology, I had the chance to study in-depth with James Bugental, who was a real master psychologist, psychotherapist, and teacher. I felt in many ways that my education or training as a psychotherapist really commenced with him. There was a group of us who learned from him in yearly five-day retreats, after which I formed a monthly consultation group with a smaller group. I call him a master because of his skill and dedication to the work and his thoughtfulness in teaching others.

As part of his work, he often demonstrated various aspects of psychotherapy, including doing demonstrations with us, either through role plays or with those of us who wished to be able to explore our own personal issues, particularly as they impacted our work as psychotherapists, which it always does, of course.

For several years, we kept saying “We needed to get this guy on tape” for the benefit of those around the world who haven’t had a chance to work with him personally. And at some point, I had the great realization that he wasn’t getting any younger. He was 80 years old, so a buddy and I recruited a couple of volunteer clients and secured the services of a videographer to record him doing two sessions with two clients.

Like many ventures, we didn’t really have a goal in mind at that early point
So, we created a videotape, VHS, which was an initial venture in crowdfunding. We actually snail mailed his mailing list of about 200 folks saying, “Would you be willing to purchase a copy of this videotape to help us in our production?” We raised a few thousand dollars, which got us maybe halfway there to the costs, chipped in some of our own money, and ended up producing a videotape.

Like many ventures, we didn’t really have a goal in mind at that early point. It was not my plan to start a business. I just wanted to make a tape and ended up going to the Evolution of Psychotherapy conference, getting a booth there selling some of these and some other videotapes. One thing led to another after that. But that’s the short version.  
LR: If I were to magically transport myself to that Evolution of Psychotherapy conference and interview that guy in the corner with the booth and the VHS tapes and asked him, “Have any idea where this thing’s going?” or “Do you have your next master in mind?” what would he have said?
VY: It was very exciting because Jeff Zeig, who runs those conferences, was kind enough to send out a letter to other speakers telling them that Victor Yalom, the son of Irvin Yalom, was going to be selling some tapes, and if others had some to contact me. I ended up getting a small collection of videotapes, including some group tapes of my father, and pricing them much lower than they were otherwise available, at the price of a textbook or a professional book. Not some of the very high-cost textbooks that we see today. 
  

There was tremendous demand and excitement, so I realized I was onto something. Now recall this was 1995, right at the birth of the internet, so if you were a professor or a therapist wanting to get or see therapy in action, it was very hard to do. There was no YouTube. There were no online courses. And the few videos that were out there were hard to track down. 
 

I realized I had found an untapped need
At that point, I realized I had found an untapped need. I’m not a trained businessperson, but I did learn a bit over the years, like when folks are pitching business ideas now, one of the things they think about is what problem are they solving? In looking back, I was solving a problem that I had experienced in graduate school. Up to that time, I had hardly ever seen a therapist do therapy, and I thought, “This is crazy.” So, I clearly felt there was something there. 

LR: So, an unintended pioneer in a market that didn’t yet exist. A venturer without capital. Aside from the technological savvy that you had to acquire along the way, were there any major obstacles in accessing the masters or getting people to sign on to this “little engine that could?”
VY:
What was more surprising was that clients were and still are willing to be on camera and reveal personal things about themselves
I think I’ve been pretty fortunate. Perhaps my enthusiasm has carried me quite a long way, and honestly, sharing the last name of my father certainly opened some doors for me. I can’t say that was a great benefit in what I was doing at the time, which was doing private practice. Certainly, name recognition is nice—and has some downsides as well—but nobody refers patients to you just because you have a famous last name. But in terms of getting legendary clinicians to return a phone call or be willing to trust themselves with me to make a recording of them, I’m sure that helped.

What was more surprising was that clients were and still are willing to be on camera and reveal personal things about themselves for the benefit of having the opportunity to get some free treatment by famous therapists, as well as contribute to the training of our field. Of course, not all clients are willing to do so, but every time we’ve wanted to produce a video, we’ve been able to find clients who are willing to bare their souls to a wider audience. I’m always grateful for that, and also feel protective of them in terms of wanting to carefully screen them to make sure that they are comfortable with the types of things that might come up and be willing to edit out material that just felt too sensitive, even if they were willing to share.  
LR: That’s an interesting perspective because in Narrative Therapy, one of the goals is to help the client assert expertise over their own life, and one aspect of that expertise is giving clients the opportunity to teach other clients through written narratives or through videotaping. 

I hadn’t thought until you just mentioned it how much value, over and above whatever benefits accrue to the audience of these videos, the clients might reap in being with a master, and how putting themselves out there might give them an opportunity to share in some way beyond the isolated room of therapy, and even truly benefit others who might be reluctant. 

VY: I feel, although I don’t know this for a fact, that some of the clients with whom we’ve worked obtain a sense of advocacy from their participation, particularly when they are part of an underrepresented population, for example, a military veteran or an African American client. We recently published a video series on counseling African American men. You know because you were a part of that. 

I strongly suspect that part of the clients’ motivation in that series was, “I can help normalize this therapy process for African American men who have certain struggles often related to racism, and I want to encourage others who may have similar struggles as me to get therapy and to train therapists in how to better work with this population.” So, I suspect there’s some sense of advocacy and caring that therapists get the best training possible to treat folks that are similar to them in whatever characteristics. 

LR: Having well over 300 video titles, how has Psychotherapy.net kept pace with the expanding demographics that psychotherapists serve?
VY: Just to be clear, yes, we do have over 350 titles now, but we have not produced all of those ourselves—maybe a third of those. The rest we’ve found by going far and wide looking for videos that were out there but, in many cases, not widely available. 

I made a conscious effort starting several years ago to produce videos with both therapists and clients of more diversity
One case always stands to mind. I made a video with Natalie Rogers, art therapist and daughter of Carl Rogers. At the end of the production, we were filming in her house, and she brought out a shoebox full of old VHS tapes and DVDs for me to look through. She entrusted me to take them home, and I reviewed them. Some were home recordings with poor video or audio quality. But I came across one excellent interview of him, professional quality, and finally tracked down that this was produced in Ireland by RTE, I believe it stands for Radio Television of Ireland. Lo and behold, they had the original master in the vault and managed to work out a deal so we could distribute it, so I recorded a new introduction with Natalie. That’s a little aside just to state that we haven’t produced all the videos we offer. 
 

But we have a legacy of titles. And I realized some time ago that we were, not surprisingly, overrepresented with master therapists. Let’s take out the term master therapists, but with White male therapists and Caucasian clients. So I made a conscious effort starting several years ago to produce videos with both therapists and clients of more diversity. So, we’ve been doing that, but I have a lot of catch-up to do. 

LR: In this era of YouTube and TikTok, the consuming public seems to crave products that pack their punch in shorter bursts. Do you see that as an obstacle to your goal at Psychotherapy.net of portraying therapists doing the real and often laborious work of therapy?
VY: It’s a balancing act, indeed. Several years ago, we did a focus group with some of our customers to try to better understand their needs, and that was certainly one of them. Therapists told us they may have a 30-minute gap in their schedule, or they may have a cancellation, and your typical videos of one or two hours in length, often showing full sessions of therapy, didn’t fit that particular need. So, we launched a collection of videos called “Mastery in Minutes” that are 30 minutes or less. They are at times new productions, at other times excerpts of our longer videos with some additional introduction or discussion. 

So, we try to meet both needs. We do try to offer shorter videos, and our longer videos are broken up into chapters. We have some very long courses that might be 6 to 10 hours, but they’re broken up into shorter chapters. 
 

One of our productions I'm most proud of, Emotionally Focused Therapy Step by Step, is the most ambitious project we’ve ever done
One of our productions I'm most proud of, Emotionally Focused Therapy Step by Step, is the most ambitious project we’ve ever done and frankly, I think that anyone has done. We filmed over 100 hours of EFT sessions with six couples and four different therapists over a year and a half, edited that down to about eight hours of sessions and a few hours of discussion and commentary. I have to give my wife, Marie-Hélène Yalom, our Senior Director of Strategy and Product Development, a lot of credit. While she’s not a therapist, she’s learned a lot about EFT and painstakingly edited this down with Rebecca Jorgensen, the main therapist featured in this project. 
 

Obviously, we don’t expect someone to sit down and watch that all at once. So it’s broken down as the title implies, step by step, into many small skill sets, and EFT, for people who know, is broken down into steps and stages. So, you can watch our longer videos in shorter chunks and skip from chapter to chapter. 

LR: It sounds like a real challenge to balance the demand to satisfy the customer but remain faithful to the practice of psychotherapy. From an insider’s perspective, I think you’ve done a nice job of that balance, but I’m a bit biased. 
VY: Yeah, it’s a tension that exists in our field and in many aspects of society, people want short-term fixes, quick fixes. People want short-term therapy. Some therapists promise that. Some approaches promise that, but whether they’re able to fulfill that promise? That’s debatable. I think at times you can convey some powerful ideas in a short amount of time. But to master them, like anything, takes—
LR: Hours….
VY: Dedication. Practice. Maybe some luck, or the right circumstances with the right clients who are ready to make some changes. Other times it’s painstaking, and you may work with a client for years and not see a lot of changes but nonetheless, they may benefit greatly from having support.
LR: How have you evolved in your approach to interviewing the masters over the last several decades?
VY:
I’m able to be myself more and reveal more of myself in all aspects of my life. I believe that shows up in doing interviews
I think it parallels my development as a human being, which is not an unusual progression in that I feel more comfortable in my skin, have more confidence that I have something to offer, and have come to accept parts of myself that I felt uncomfortable with or ashamed of not as only part of who I am, but that I like and feel proud of. So, I’m able to be myself more and reveal more of myself in all aspects of my life. I believe that shows up in doing interviews. That hopefully shows up in how I do therapy, how I relate to my friends and loved ones.

Specifically, in interviews, I feel more confidence that I know a lot about therapy. I have to be a jack of all trades to know a little bit about different techniques and approaches as I’m producing videos of various types. I don’t have the academic background like you do, and don’t keep up as much with the research, but I feel I know enough to ask questions and engage in dialogues that I hope are informative to our viewers and entertaining to watch in the sense of seeing the discussions and the therapy sessions, which are typically featured in our videos as being alive and representing the best of humanity.  
LR: One of the qualities of your interviewing style, which I assume filters into your therapeutic style as well, and perhaps into your personal style, is that you don’t seem afraid to ask hard questions. You’re clearly willing to put someone on the spot in search of the most real they will allow you to have access to.

And that, to me, suggests a certain degree of confidence, and also an unwillingness to accept what’s offered as expertise without proof of that expertise. So, that’s just sort of a side comment for those of who will venture into this interview, which will probably take more than five minutes to read. I think it’s as important to watch your style of interviewing these masters, and the way you hold them accountable for their presumed expertise, rather than just fawning over these masters.  

The Art and Artistry of Psychotherapy

LR: Most of your audience “knows” you through the interviews you’ve done with master therapists and through the cartoons you create for the site, but they likely don’t know that you also work in paint, metal, and wood. I’m wondering how this continual drive to express your creativity has manifested in your own identity and practice as a therapist?
VY: Interestingly enough, I didn’t grow up doing things I considered artistic, certainly not in the visual arts. This all started at a workshop with my mentor, James Bugental. I have a hard time sitting still and listening, so I would draw. I was drawing little stick figure cartoons, one of which eventually evolved into a cartoon. It was a stick figure of a cactus laying on a sofa saying, “Well, I didn’t come from what you would call a touchy-feely family.” 

My drawings were literally stick figures. And when I created the website, I had an idea to put a few cartoons up there, so I hired some people who knew how to draw and took these ideas and made cartoons out of them. And then at some point, an ex-girlfriend of mine said, “Well, you have a very primitive drawing style, you should draw them yourself.” So, I started drawing my own cartoons, and that led me to taking a painting class, and as you mentioned, I now do metal sculptures. But this all started maybe 20 years ago when I was about 40. So, I credit Psychotherapy.net with helping me to discover some activities that bring me a great deal of pleasure. 
 

increasingly view therapy as a creative enterprise
In terms of your question about how that may impact my therapy or show up in my therapy, I increasingly view therapy as a creative enterprise. I grew up in an academic family. My parents are writers. I’m taking another little aside here, but I always had an interest in or fascination with the business world but was very much an outsider, and back then, you know, when I graduated from college, you couldn’t start a business as you can today. If you wanted to work in the business world, you worked in a Fortune 500 company. I tried and I was fired. I failed miserably. 
 

And in the process of creating Psychotherapy.net, which was just a side hobby for many years while I was in full-time practice, I came to realize that building and growing a business is the ultimate creative enterprise. I had an idea to make a videotape, I took that idea and created something from it, and then that evolved to something else, which evolved into something else. 
 

And now here, you and I are having this interview on a technology that didn’t exist when I started this, so getting finally to your question about psychotherapy; it’s an extremely creative enterprise, just like this conversation. A client comes in and says something and you react, you have internal reactions, and then somehow words come out of your mouth and you say something, and it goes from there. 
 

You don’t know what’s going to happen with what you do with them and what’s going to happen with their life. You try to adapt what you do and what you say in a way that’s going to be helpful. Certainly, there are certain approaches that give you more structure or guidance, and those can be critiqued as overly manualized or cookie-cutter, but ultimately, in my opinion, if you’re going to do work that’s at all meaningful and helpful, you need to find a way to enter their world and to do so in a creative and imaginative way. 

LR: And that goes back to what you were saying before in terms of your own personal evolution, becoming more comfortable with who you are in your own skin, warts and all. I think therapists are most effective when they are most genuine and when they’re most vulnerable, and they invite themselves into a co-creative experience with their client. That’s evident in watching you work, at least in the interviews.

You have taken what I consider a heroic step, as you recently transitioned from the man behind the camera to the man in front of it. You did part one of an experiential teletherapeutic interview with an Italian woman. I wonder what it took for you to put the director’s hat down and step in front of the camera and, in a sense, expose yourself to your audience in a new way?  
VY: I feel very fortunate that I had a chance to study with quite talented therapists like James Bugental and, of course, learn a tremendous amount from my father, and then in the process of creating other videos work with and get to know Sue Johnson and Peter Levine and Otto Kernberg and Reid Wilson, and many others. Some I had more contact with and thus learned more from, and others less. 

I feel reasonably confident that I have some things to offer myself and some important things I’ve learned that I don’t think are widely taught
And over the years, like I think any maturing therapist, I have been able to integrate and internalize that into my own style of working to the point where I feel reasonably confident that I have some things to offer myself and some important things I’ve learned that I don’t think are widely taught. 

LR: Such as?
VY: Two things come to mind. From Bugental, some specific techniques to help clients more vibrantly explore their internal world, their subjective experience in an alive and present way versus just talking about themselves. In particular, he taught some specific techniques as well as an underlying philosophy, and numerous ways to deepen that exploration. He suggested that therapists often encounter what he referred to as resistance, which can be a confusing term. Another way of thinking of it is that we get stuck in our ways, whether you call them defense mechanisms or just modes of coping or ways of being.

As we know as therapists, it’s hard for clients to really change the way they adapt to situations even when they aren’t helpful. So, we can help clients explore themselves, but often they reach a wall or there are restrictions in their ability to explore freely, and those could be that they intellectualize, that they shut down, that they focus excessively on pleasing you and the people around them and have a hard time accessing their own experiences and needs. So, in the process of getting them to do this internal searching, as he called it, you hit these roadblocks. He taught ways to help identify and loosen up those roadblocks; that might be a way of putting it. So those are some things that he taught me that feel very vital and powerful, and I don’t think are widely known.

with the advent of online therapy, it's been much easier to make recordings of not just one session, but longer-term therapy
And my father writes a lot about working interpersonally in the here and now between client and therapist in a way that I haven’t seen discussed much in other forms of therapy. How do you use the here and now of the therapeutic relationship? How do you work with that in a way that’s beneficial to the client?

So those are a few ideas that I feel are important and I don’t see discussed or represented in most of the types of therapies that are generally taught. Now, there are exceptions to that, but I feel compelled to teach them. And I’ve been mulling over this for several years now. And finally, with the advent of online therapy, it's been much easier to make recordings of not just one session, but longer-term therapy. I’ve just completed the course of seeing a client for 18 sessions, which we recorded, and I’m at the beginning stages of producing a course that will include excerpts of these sessions, and hopefully of some other colleagues as well, to teach some of these ideas.   
LR: You’ve mentioned James Bugental numerous times as being historically and personally influential in your own life’s work. So, I want to ask you, Victor Yalom—perhaps you haven’t thought in these terms before, but do you see yourself as an influencer?
VY:
I’m proud of what we’ve created with Psychotherapy.net, and I think we’ve done something useful and I’m certainly part of that
IOver the years running Psychotherapy.net, we’d get phone calls and emails, and sometimes when I’d answer the phone, I would get comments like, “Oh, I can’t believe I’m talking to Dr. Yalom,” and I always assumed they were confusing me with my father.
LR:  would never do that. [Note: LR actually did this when first applying for the Editorship]. 
VY: And many times they were. But since you asked, I can’t resist responding from time to time to customer emails. I find it helpful to keep my finger on the pulse of what’s happening there. And occasionally I do get people who know me from the videos I’ve made. Our videos are widely used in universities in the US and around the world, so it’s fair to say that I’m proud of what we’ve created with Psychotherapy.net, and I think we’ve done something useful and I’m certainly part of that.

The Long View

LR: As someone who has had a front seat to the evolution of the field of psychotherapy over three decades, how do you think the field has changed on your watch? Or more specifically, what tensions in the field have you noticed?
VY: It’s really hard to say. I remember when I just started grad school, Nick Cummings, who started the California School of Professional Psychology, and hence the whole professional psychology school movement (we have an interview of him on our site), gave us a rousing lecture about how private practice is dead. This was in the late 80s, and that hasn’t come to pass. 

In terms of approaches, CBT and other so-called evidence-based approaches are being taught much more widely. I have concerns about that. I think that yes, we want to do therapy that’s effective, and yet we seem to have traded on the idea that evidence-based treatment somehow defies this entire other line of valid research showing that the most important elements of change are the therapeutic relationship and client factors. 
 

The research consistently shows that one approach is not better than another approach
The research consistently shows that one approach is not better than another approach. And that may be just a research limitation—there are so many complexities and variables involved. But it’s clearly easier to research treatment methods than relationship variables, and there’s more funding available to research certain types, so there may be more data showing that those approaches are effective, but that does not mean that other approaches are less effective. 
 

So I don’t know what the answer is. I’m not involved in policy making or in formal training programs. But I am concerned about the narrowness or limitations that seem to be taught in many of the clinical graduate programs that students are being trained in. 
 

There are obvious other big changes in the field, the most striking of which is the move to online therapy that accelerated with the onset of COVID. And that’s never going to go back to fully in-person, though it’ll be a hybrid model. I think in many ways, it’s a good thing. It’s going to increase accessibility. It’s going to increase availability. 
 

I continue to do a group that moved online. While I was reluctant to do so initially, it allowed people who have moved or are on vacation or in another town to continue to be in the group. So, it’s better in that way, but you do lose the vitality of the in-person group experience. 
 

We all know of these other changes, app-based therapy, chat therapy, different pricing models, etc. There are problems with many of them, the reimbursement rates for therapists are quite low. Does chat have a useful place in therapy? The good thing, I think, is that it’s loosened up this historic and restrictive idea that therapy should be once a week in the office for 50 minutes, which came out of the idea that people have to get in their cars every day and drive to the office. Well, you know, I was guilty of that as well, in having our staff work primarily in the office. Suddenly we realized, as with all our assumptions, that doesn’t need to be the case. 
 

Therapy, like most every other business, has moved online and is doing just fine. So, in terms of therapy, what’s the best way to do it? Can it be fully online? Can you, when possible, combine online with in-person sessions? Should it be every week for 50 minutes? Should it be some more fluid model? I mean, for clients in crisis, why not meet for 90 minutes or two hours, and why not be able to have email or text during the week? Then you have to come up with different pricing models for reimbursement. But surely, we’re not going to go back to once a week in the office for 50 minutes, and I think that’s a good thing. 

LR: Traditional models have to be challenged and evaluated on a regular basis, or else they just become vestigial.

As we near the end of our time together and this journey you’ve taken us on, I can’t help but to reflect on the passage of time since I was in graduate school and what I have witnessed. And maybe it’s just a function of my getting older, but are therapists getting younger? It seems that therapists are getting younger and younger each day.  
VY: It’s incredible.
LR: They’re getting master’s degrees at 22 years old and within a year, and at the cost of sounding jaded and cynical, they have business cards advertising that they specialize in working with children, adults, and the elderly.
VY: I don’t know if people even have business cards anymore.
LR: Right. We have websites. It just seems that the entire field, both therapists and clients, if not society, is so much more restless, so much more impatient, and as you said before, hungry for quick change. Everybody’s an expert. There are a thousand books out there, 18 ways to this and 17 ways to that. How will Psychotherapy.net survive that seemingly insatiable hunger for more, faster, shorter, and sexier? What will be the secret to your survival? 
VY:
as many of the masters die off or have died already, we try to find clinicians who are doing good work and try to capture that work on camera
I’m not worried about that. I think we just have to keep producing relevant, good content, and
as many of the masters die off or have died already, we try to find clinicians who are doing good work and try to capture that work on camera. That’s what differentiates us from most of the competition out there. 

Most of the online training seems to be done primarily by talking heads, lectures, webinars, and it just seems crazy to me that this is the way training has traditionally been done in our field, reading books, talking about therapy. In every other field, and I’ve said this over and over and over again, whether you’re a plumber, a dancer, a lawyer, or an architect, you learn by watching others do their work. I mean, you have to study and know the basics, but you learn by watching other masters doing their work, your bosses. 
 

You’re in court. You’re in second seat in a trial, and then your bosses are watching you do the work and giving you feedback, giving you coaching. Hopefully, constructive feedback. So, that’s kind of the essence of what we do, which is to show excerpts of therapy in action and explain why we’re doing it. Now, certainly, we’ll adapt. We’d like to do some live events, live webinars, and do these interviews. I don’t know what we’ll be doing, exactly. People talk about gamification and interactive video. I haven’t seen much of that yet, at least in our field, that’s useful. So, I’m not worried about that. 
 

I think the great thing about our field is that life experience helps
In terms of your thing about therapists getting younger, well, obviously, there’s partly a tongue-in-cheek thing going on there, because we’re getting older. I still have this little thing going back to Transactional Analysis, kind of a one-down stance where I still feel like I’m the kid in the room. I’m often surprised, I may be emailing people, I get on a Zoom call, and “Hey! You look so young.” I’m still kind of assuming that I’m going to be the youngest. 
 

But I think the great thing about our field is that life experience helps. Yes, you’re more in touch with young students, or have been as a professor for many years, but it’s a great profession for people to go into as a second career. If you start doing this when you’re 30 or 40 or 50, what a gift that you know something about life, having worked in other fields, having children, having a family, having suffered losses that invariably occur. So, you do what you can with the resources you have, and hopefully those grow over time. 

LR: Kicking and screaming in some cases. I think that’s it for me for now, Victor. Do you have any last thoughts or questions you want to ask me or reflections on how our time together went for you?
VY: It’s been a pleasure working with you over the last several years, Larry. In terms of this conversation, what I’ve tried to do is to respond in the moment to thoughts or feelings that come up as we’ve been talking.

I’ve done a number of these interviews, we’ve been on podcasts, and I just realized it’s easy to start telling the same stories over and over again. It’s an interesting phenomenon. And if you think about therapy, it’s easy for clients to do that. They tell a story about the losses they’ve had or the disappointments they’ve had, and it’s important for them to convey that to you. But as Frieda Reichmann has allegedly said, “Patients need an experience, not an explanation.”

It’s strange and honorable, and at times a captivating and rewarding profession to be able to sit with clients and enter their world
I don’t know if I’ve said anything new. Hopefully, I’ve conveyed some ideas that someone will find interesting. As I reflect on our conversation, the one thing that stands out is when you asked me about my own evolution and I talked about becoming more comfortable with myself and things that I was uncomfortable with, and I used the words “ashamed of.” That felt like one moment where I said something I don’t think I’ve said before.

I’m sure it’s true for all of us. We have things about ourselves that we don’t feel good about or feel ashamed of or feel vulnerable around. And it’s also true that those, in general, for me, are much more contained and more in the past, and I’m grateful for that.

As I say that, it makes me think about the work of a therapist and the work we do with clients to really cherish and embrace the idea that everyone has this unique world inside of them, and sometimes that world is extremely painful and chaotic. Sometimes that world is just chugging along and doing okay, and sometimes that world is expansive and exciting. It’s strange and honorable, and at times a captivating and rewarding profession to be able to sit with clients and enter their world and see what help we can be to them in navigating their life’s journey.  
LR: From my perspective, and as I prepared for this interview, I was acutely aware that our relationships these past five years have evolved. And as I became more comfortable in my space in our relationship, I’ve come to feel more confident, not just in my role as Psychotherapy.net’s Editor, but also in my own skin. I think every good relationship, whether it’s therapeutic or not, is a growth opportunity, whether it’s inside of a therapy room or not.

And I wasn’t looking for this interview to be a growth opportunity per se. I wanted to offer you something interesting; how do I ask interesting questions when you’ve been asked so many similar questions before? There was a part of me that wanted to ask interesting enough questions to interest you, to please you. I wanted, and perhaps still do want, to be interesting, relevant. Perhaps even more so after having retired from the university. I wanted to honor what you’ve done, and I wanted to also provoke you when I could without unnecessarily doing so. I wanted to create, I guess, as in therapy, a safe space where sharing could happen.

This was different from some of the other interviews that I’ve seen conducted with you. I sensed an even greater level of vulnerability, especially in that comment you made about shame, and I was very impressed with your willingness to share that. So, before we sign up as the first two members of the mutual admiration society, I’ll say goodbye and thank you again for welcoming us into your space.  
VY: Well, thank you very much, Larry. It’s been a wonderful and enriching conversation. 

Improving Your Clinical Presence with Receptivity and Gratitude

Suggested Tips for Clinicians: 

  • Practice methods for strengthening your therapeutic presence.
  • Ask yourself if you are or are not empathically attuned with each client.
  • Explore barriers to full presence and empathy with more challenging clients.

 

A capacity crowd in the large conference hall rose to its feet in applause. Daniel Siegel, renowned author, clinical professor of psychiatry at the UCLA School of Medicine and Executive Director of the Mindsight Institute, had finished his presentation. I too stood with enthusiastic appreciation, not only for this lecture, featuring the clinical significance of therapists’ mindfulness, but for all the ways his research and writing about developmentally informed parenting, neuroplasticity, and the incorporation of science into the practice of psychotherapy. All of these had influenced my thinking and work over the past ten years.   
 

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Dan had begun to move away from the podium when he seemed to catch himself and walked back to centerstage. He stood, fully facing the hall, hands clasped in front, nodded his head and bowed. For our part, the applause of several thousand therapist attendees showed no sign of relenting. Then an event unfolded I have carried with me since. 


It began with the simplest of gestures. Dan took and held Tadasana, a standing yoga pose. His feet parallel and facing forward, Dan released his fingers, opening his hands which moved to the sides of his legs, palms open, shoulders relaxed as he appeared to empty himself and stand receptive before the crowd.  
 

The audience responded with delight and gratitude at this embodied receptivity. The volume of the applause rose, and Dan, smiling gently, took a deep breath. The crowd responded again. Waves of mindful presence, enthusiasm and gratitude rolled through the large hall back and forth, until Dan took a final bow and joined the crowd he had just helped to unify.  
 

Gratitude is amplified by its reception. Reception is its own expression of gratitude. A feedback loop, formed by gratitude and receptivity, generates a mindful, compassionate field that feels very much like love.  
 

Tears rolled down my professional cheeks. I quickly brushed them away hoping the strangers around me noticed neither my intense emotion nor its expression. Unleashed by the power of that loving field, my tears flowed freely and powerfully, apparently straining for release. I felt seen, heard, and appreciated. I was included, a true part of this collegial, communal event. There was a transcendent quality in which this loving field was not so much being created but being acknowledged as existing before this moment. All of us stumbled into an awareness of a much larger and enduring field of love.   
 

I was awed by the immediacy and goodness of the human family. But it was an ecstasy undifferentiated from loss and longing. My tears expressed my grief at how seldom I had been aware of my presence in such a space. Having often felt unseen, unheard, and unappreciated, I suddenly experienced a sense of loneliness and despair of enduring connection. The pangs of longing and the shame of my dissatisfactions with self and others were ignited by my embrace of this mass symbiosis. Yet, there was also relief at the quenching of my childhood thirst for an uninhibited expression of mutual affirmation and solidarity.   
 

In the religious experiences of my young adulthood as a youth minister, a shared faith and religious ritual turned what might have been merely an experience of communal intimacy into an encounter with the metaphysical. My peers and I tasted, not merely the immediate experience, but elements of a universal interconnectedness: with one another, with the Church, and even, it seemed, with God.     


As I grew older and my religiosity subsided, the felt importance of that faith and my need to participate in a loving field never waned. If Dan Siegel had continued off stage to privately appreciate the applause, he may very well have experienced a profound sense of what his work meant to us, he may have been moved to tears and even been motivated to write another great text, but his personal experience of appreciation and inspiration would not have generated the mindful, compassionate field of love we all shared. To generate such a field, he had to turn around and move back to the edge of the stage, putting himself on display. He needed to make the mindful choice to allow his body to express his emotional state, ultimately taking a posture of reception easily understood by the community before him.  
 

As an audience member, I too had a role in creating the moment. While Dan closed his presentation, I might have remained seated, turned to a neighboring attendee and, in a relatively hushed tone, remarked upon an outstanding insight or application. My neighbor may have responded with her own insight and drawn my attention to aspects of the presented theories elucidating my thinking. This might all have had a positive impact on my practice, but none of it would have generated the field of love.   
 

 All of us that day physically manifested our emotional reaction by standing, applauding loudly, and maintaining focus on Dan. We allowed his gestures to carry meaning and translated that meaning into action with vocalizations of delight and even louder applause.  
 

After any professional conference I strive to identify the clinical application of what I have learned, knowing that for me to retain information I need to utilize it. While I came away from that conference with much information, it was this personal, emotional experience that I most wanted to incorporate into my life and work.  
 

But where would this powerful manifestation of gratitude and receptivity play out in the consultation room? Although, as a psychotherapist I am sometimes the recipient of heartfelt expressions of appreciation, I have never received a standing ovation. Nor do I often feel deserving or desirous of one! The emotional waves of gratitude between therapist and client are smaller and quieter and, as a possible result, the loving field we generate is more easily dismissed or completely overlooked.  
 

It is a process that unfolds in many sessions. It unfolds with the subtlety of a raised brow, a silence, the slightest of gestures. It is carried by a word, a smile, a tear. We know it as empathic attunement and the creation of a therapeutic space. It is enacted when a client experiences acceptance in response to long held shame. I wonder how open my stance is in receiving such gratitude. Does the client feel my reception and the gratitude I feel for their gracious expression?  
 

Recently, in a relational-process group I co-facilitate with my colleague Aisha Mabarak, a field of love made a surprising appearance. Sheila* arrived late due to complications at her job that held her past the end of her shift. She reported being exhausted and ill-prepared to share her feelings with the group. 


“I’m in a fog,” Sheila said with an uncharacteristically flat tone. I responded by thanking her for making it to the session and affirming her inclination to take a restful, though present, pose. Aisha, however, had a different approach. Not wasting any time, she asked: “Sheila, why don’t you share with the group a little more about this fog you feel stuck in?”  
 

Sheila proceeded to describe, with increasing emotional range, how deadened she felt by a sense of invisibility in multiple facets of her life. Examples spilled forth of her efforts to meet the needs of others only to be met with thoughtlessness and a glaring absence of gratitude from family members, friends, colleagues, and bosses.  
 

Other group members expressed empathy and support. One member voiced these sentiments succinctly, saying that she felt Sheila’s pain and she was, at that moment, imagining how hurtful and difficult it must be to feel so unappreciated by people who care for you. In approximately fifteen minutes Sheila had gone from a depression-based brain fog to expressing her anger and upset assertively, leading to smiling and expressions of appreciation for her fellow group members.  
 

My inclination to support Sheila by giving her space was intended to express, both to her and to the group, that it was acceptable to feel your pain in session and to choose to set self-protective boundaries. This intervention may have been simply wrongheaded, or it may have, by reminding members of their autonomy, laid the foundation for co-facilitator Aisha’s fruitful follow-up. While I had responded to Sheila’s verbal communication and her depressed presentation, Aisha responded to another expressed impulse—this one non-verbal.  


Sheila expressed her impulse to participate in the group by showing up and letting us know how bad she felt. Rather than disappearing off stage, a space she was also entitled to occupy, she had moved her body to a visible place. Rather than closing herself off, she showed us how she felt, as Daniel Siegel had opened his hands and exposed his palms.  


Aisha’s response might be analogous to the convention applause. This applause was an essential welcoming saying: “Sheila, your sadness, hurt, embarrassment and anger are all welcomed here!” Group members said: “This is your group! Take the time you need. We are here for you. We see you. We hear you.”  


Hearing and feeling this welcoming presence, Sheila responded at first with tears, then with expressions of anger and ultimately with smiles and the laughter of gratitude for the group’s support. The faces of the other members lit up with warmth and solidarity.  
 

*** 


Facilitating such moments of conscious gratitude and receptivity is something I try to bring to all my sessions. Of critical importance is my understanding that my role in this regard is that of facilitator, not creator. It is a powerful, organic experience that can only be had within the context of a collaborative effort. Daniel Siegel, for all his talents and wisdom, could not create that field of love by himself. Nor could the audience of thousands of therapists, even if they were consciously working in unison to do so!  


As a therapist, my receptivity to gratitude only increases the availability to the client of a mindful, compassionate field. A field, that I argue, has the healing qualities of love.  
 

While love is not “all we need” in the consultation room, it is a quality of human experience necessary to both healing and health.  

 

*This client’s name has been changed.  

How to Overcome Self-Doubt as a Therapist

“Steve, I’ve decided to stop talking to Marc,” said Sheila, starting the session without the usual pleasantries. I could hardly contain my excitement. 
 

I had been working with Sheila for two years, attempting to help her develop a sense of self-worth. She had been in and out of multiple abusive relationships and thought very poorly of herself. This was despite having two master’s degrees, a rewarding career, and being highly attractive (all societal markers of success). 
 

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Sheila had permitted Marc to enter her life and erode what little self-confidence she had left in the wake of the abuse she had suffered prior to meeting him. She complained of his manipulation tactics and how he had recently “gotten a prostitute pregnant behind my back.” I was ecstatic that she was finally standing up for herself. 


I decided to follow up with a Rogerian type of approach. I feared that questioning might be too confrontational. Instead, I wanted Sheila to reflect on where she got her courage from to finally cut Marc off. Secretly, I wanted to be praised for being a world-class therapist. I wanted to hear that our work had paid off and that she felt stronger. So insecure and immature of me, right?! 


“Say more about that,” I gently nudged. “Well, my psychic told me not to do it,” she replied flatly. Two years of weekly 45-minute sessions invalidated by a single 15-minute psychic reading. It felt as though I had been punched in the stomach. I could feel my face getting numb. I was at a loss for words. 


“She told me that Marc is bad news and has wicked intentions for me,” Sheila continued quite proudly. While I was pleased that she was no longer tolerating oppression, I felt small and insignificant. I also thought of it as a flight into health. One discussion, and now Sheila was cured. It made me reflect on countless times that my therapeutic efforts were dismissed by a client who just so happened to be influenced by a friend, clergy member, or some insight they received on TikTok. 
 

This case caused me to reflect deeply on my role as a helper. Why did I feel the need to be the sole agent of change for Sheila? Why wasn’t I more open to all (other) avenues of support that Sheila could receive? Doesn’t it take a village? I also wondered about how often clients come to me for direct advice. Sheila was no exception. 
 

So many times, I have non-directively responded to “What do you think I should do?” with “What would you like to do?” It is not that I am afraid to answer questions from my clients. I do it often. However, I have found it to be ineffective to give clients direct answers when their presenting problems are highly nuanced—such as relationship dynamics in the case of Sheila. If the advice works, I’m heralded. If it fails, I’m demonized. I find it much more effective, as well as in their interests, to help clients come up with their own solutions. 


Within two weeks, predictably, Sheila was sending Marc a barrage of text messages and outwardly professing all his admirable qualities. There was no longer any mention of the psychic. “What good is that psychic now?” I wanted to cry out but restrained myself. Instead, I maintained a calm, nonjudgmental demeanor and allowed Sheila to tell me all about what led her to reach back out to Marc. 


By the end of that session, Sheila thanked me for “always being there for me.” That was all the validation I needed. She reminded me that while all the men in her life—including her father — were inconsistent, I was the one man who stood by her side. It wasn’t necessarily about giving or not giving her advice. Sheila is smart enough to make her own decisions and deal with the consequences. It was more about the fact that I was the one person who had been there for her. 


I had spent two years of therapeutic effort wondering when I would say something that might resonate with Sheila. However, the true work has revolved around being a consistent and supportive presence in her life. My work with Sheila is far from over, but I do feel that I am on the right track for us to make meaningful progress together. 
 

Questions for Therapeutic Thought 

  • What about the author’s experience with this client challenged you to think about your own clinical work? 
  • What types of clients trigger your own self-doubt and how do you address that discomfort? 
  • How might you have addressed this particular issue with Sheila? 

Making Clichés Work in Therapy

My work with Nathaniel was focused on the growing intensity of his depression. Things were going badly at work, his intimate relationship was not providing him joy, and he felt increasingly lethargic and unmotivated. His affect was flat and his voice emotionless as he assessed his life through the lens of this depression. I reflected these feelings back to him, showing him the picture he had just painted. Nathaniel seemed to take it in and as we sat with it for a bit and expressed hope that one day he’d get over the sadness. I assured him he would but acknowledged the frustration that comes with not knowing when a bout of depression will end or what can be done to make it end. Nathaniel sighed and said, “I guess the sun'll come out tomorrow.” He groaned and slumped down further down in his seat, as if that phrase had just added rather than reduced the weight of his sadness.

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Phillipa had goals. Our main topic of discussion was dissatisfaction with her career. She was, however, in the process of taking steps to change this. She was exploring other areas of professional interest and talking to people in those fields, preparing both logistically and emotionally to engage in the kind of change she had expressed a desire to experience. After a few sessions in which she felt hopeful and inspired based on positive feedback from friends and family, Phillipa was riding high, until our most recent session, that is, when she learned that the career she most wanted to pursue required an advanced degree that she felt she was not in a position to pursue. Phillipa shook her head forlornly as she verbalized her frustrations, saying, “It just feels like it’s always two steps forward, one step back.”

Ravena craved a committed romantic relationship. We had identified her pattern regarding the development of these types of relationships, and her frustration that they did not end up in the place that she wanted. There was a cycle of intense attraction at first, with both emotional and physical connection, but these enjoyable beginnings always devolved into conflict, with Ravena experiencing difficulty understanding her instincts regarding boundaries and intimacy, and frustration that her instincts seemed to run counter to what she wanted. Ravena became more open to exploring her family of origin and the type of relationship modeling her parents provided, and our work became more about identifying how the best way to work towards positive relationships in the present was to examine the lessons imprinted on her from the past. “I guess I just have to learn to love myself before I can love someone else,” said Ravena, as she rubbed her temples and laughed bitterly in a physical manifestation of the frustration she was feeling inside.

***

These examples of work with clients are both specific to my experience as a therapist and universal to what it means to be human. The vignettes all demonstrate how, when assessing their progress and desires in therapy, clients often come to a point where they express their feelings and insights through cliché, and how the use of that cliché usually has a negative connotation. Why is this? Why does something as simple and universal as a cliché seem to leave such a bad taste in the mouths of these clients?

A cliché is an overused phrase or opinion that can often mimic an original thought or even epiphany. We call something a cliché when we’ve heard it a million times, so often that any meaning it once had has been eclipsed by our collective shrug when we hear it again. We sometimes experience negative thoughts about ourselves when we use these clichés because it implies we are lacking in original thought. And for some reason, to be lacking in original thought is a bad thing. We should suffer in original ways!

In addition, the fact that we are in therapy can color our response to clichés. When our clients are out in the world interacting with friends and family, they might find themselves using a phrase like “It’s always darkest before the dawn” or the classic “It is what it is” and feel okay about it. Or, more specifically, they don’t feel bad about it. The use of a cliché in these situations seems to pass by without much consideration, with no bad emotional taste being left in the cliché user’s mouth. However, in session our clients are at their most vulnerable, and often come in already feeling depressed or anxious or unsettled, and this baseline combined with the triteness of a cliché can make them feel worse. It’s a common reaction, and a wonderful opportunity to explore what these particular clichés mean and why our clients react the way they do, both in terms of what the clichés mean in general and what they mean to them.

Nathaniel seemed more depressed when he said that the sun will come out tomorrow. It seemed that in trying to make himself feel better, he had actually created more material to be depressed about. I mentioned Nathaniel’s mood and his reaction to the cliché, which he immediately responded to, almost eager to talk about how using this particular cliché made him somehow feel worse, even though the intended outcome was the opposite. I spoke a little about the meaning of clichés, how they come into existence, trying to work backwards from their origin to their original intent. We imagined the first person to use this phrase long ago, perhaps to cheer up a sad friend, and how that friend might have reacted. Nathaniel admitted that yes, this long-ago friend must certainly have been cheered up by this realization that the sun will come out the next day. We took turns interpreting what “the sun will come out tomorrow” actually means, both in terms of life in general and Nathaniel’s specific situation. By the end of the conversation, Nathaniel was sitting up in his chair, was more engaged, and spoke with more passion in his voice. I noted this, and Nathaniel admitted that he felt better. Talking more about clichés and how we react to them helped in this case. Our cliché journey had come full circle, from inspirational to trite and back to inspirational again.

Phillipa became frustrated at the first sign of resistance. After weeks of positive feedback and relative success, she would shut down at the first sign of trouble. She took plenty of steps forward, but those one-step-backs were devastating. We examined more closely the cliché about taking two steps forward and one step back, how this fit into a pattern for her like a dance step. When do we usually talk about things in terms of two steps forward, one step back? It’s usually when we have a goal and that goal feels like it’s far off in the distance, and we are slowly getting closer to it but we’re not moving fast enough to get over the frustration of not being there yet. I assured Phillipa that experiencing this cycle could just as easily be construed as a good thing. Two steps forward minus one step back equals a net gain of one step! For Phillipa, the frustration of not reaching the goal was eclipsing the very real process she was making. Our work together became about reframing the cliché as actually taking one step back from a kind of failure into a healthy break on the path of overall progress, as a necessary step in the dance of personal growth. Examining this cliché helped us realize together that the one step back is just as important as the two steps forward, and in the process we normalized that one backward step.

Ravena was so concerned with finding a partner that she had never pictured herself being alone. Just the idea of talking about what it would be like to live life by herself without a partner made her uncomfortable. The cliché about loving oneself became an opportunity to explore the fear that came up when we discussed the idea of being alone. This led to some significant insight into the nature of Ravena’s intimacy issues when relationships started to become serious, and after some time working on these issues, she noted that it was nice to focus only on her and the things under her control rather than on a relationship. In later sessions when Ravena had reflected on some understanding about why she reacted to some issue in “the old way” and recognized how she could change it, I noted that it seemed like she was really learning to love herself. This time the cliché was met with a smile and a knowing laugh.

***

Something about talk therapy I particularly enjoy is when the client and I identify a simple thought, perhaps one that is a part of the very foundation of how we see ourselves, and we turn this thought on its head. We examine it from a different perspective. We ask if this thought is still valid. When this occurs, things clients assumed they already knew transformed into opportunities for self-exploration and growth. I also react similarly when a client uses a cliché in a sad, pessimistic way. We take that seeming truth, turn it on its head, and ask, “Why does this cliché that purports to make us happier make us feel just the opposite? Let’s discuss.” This often results in clients begrudgingly admitting that yes, these clichés do have value, and sure, “maybe I should feel better than I do about using this cliché, and perhaps maybe even feel better about my life in general.” These cliché-dependent clients often benefit from the realization that they don’t have to feel bad about engaging in a cliché or have to necessarily feel better just because they happened upon on in a moment of seeming clarity. Sure, it’s trite, but let’s own that. It’s okay to feel trite. Better trite than depressed! Let’s give ourselves permission to not be original. I like to tell my clients that if they find themselves using clichés more often, it’s not something to sulk about, it’s a good thing. It means they can and often do actually see the light at the end of the tunnel and smell the greener grass on the other side of the street. Using and then mining the clichés can be and often are a sign that they are on the right path!

Corrective Emotional Experience Is the Key to Therapeutic Effectiveness

During my early training in psychotherapy, I was struggling to understand my role and what to say to patients. A wise supervisor introduced me to the term “corrective emotional experience” and said that once I fully understood its implications, my job would seem a whole lot simpler and I’d have much less trouble finding useful things to say to patients. He taught me that the main and unifying goal of all psychotherapies is to help patients have new and better experiences, both in the sessions and also in the rest of their lives. Such experiences could heal wounds from the past, change perceptions and attitudes in the present, and result in healthier behaviors and virtuous cycles in the future. Virtuous cycles are positive mirror images of the negative vicious cycles that so often grease a slippery downward slope for people with emotional problems. A virtuous cycle starts with a small corrective emotional experience which triggers a chain of other desirable experiences in a continuous cycle of improvement. An example would be where someone afraid of socializing screws up the courage to take a tennis lesson and gets invited to a party, which results in a new friendship, which makes it easier to approach other people socially in a variety of other social relationships, which improves job performance, which results in a raise, which increases confidence, and so on. This advice hit home, stuck with me, and has ever since guided all my clinical work and teaching. Corrective emotional experience is, I think, the best way to understand the mechanism of psychotherapy process and change—and also to integrate the bewildering variety of therapy techniques into one unified and harmonious psychotherapy. The process best explains the process of change as it occurs across all forms of psychotherapy. Sandor Ferenczi introduced this experiential way of viewing psychotherapy change in the 1920s. He was a master clinician who understood and made use of the healing power of the therapeutic relationship. His suggestion, radical at the time, was that emotional experiences in therapy, not intellectual insights, are the real drivers of change. As his student Sandor Rado would put it much later, “Insight alone never cured anything but ignorance.” It’s fair to say that Ferenczi, not Freud, had the most important influence on psychotherapy as it is practiced today. Freud readily admitted that he found clinical work interesting mostly as a research tool, necessary to build and test his theories of mental functioning, but was much less engaged in the human and healing elements of therapy. His patients were often disappointed, describing Freud as talking too much, too abstractly, and too didactically. In 1946, Franz Alexander (another of Ferenczi’s students) named and concisely defined Ferenczi’s theory of change: “The patient, in order to be helped, must undergo a corrective emotional experience suitable to repair the traumatic influence of previous experiences. It is of secondary importance whether this corrective experience takes place during treatment in the transference relationship, or parallel with the treatment in the daily life of the patient.” In answering the crucial therapy question of how best to promote corrective emotional experiences, the first insight I have is that psychotherapy sessions are not all created equal. Change tends to occur in leaps, not in small steady increments. I have treated some patients intensely for years—with absolutely no discernable progress. In contrast, I have seen many patients for only fifteen minutes in the emergency room who years later said something along the lines of “you probably don’t remember me, but you said something I’ve never forgotten that changed my life.” This makes every patient contact an adventure, potentially ripe with opportunity, never routine. There is always the possibility of a magic moment in therapy—saying something that promotes a corrective emotional experience and sets off a virtuous cycle. We can’t expect magic moments to happen often, we can’t predict them, we probably won’t even know that they have happened—but we can and should always be alert for the potential and try to create favorable conditions through our relationship with the patient. While the unifying goal of all therapies is, or at least should be, to help patients have corrective emotional experiences, there are many different ways of getting there. Sometimes the corrective emotional experience comes from an insight that clarifies how the past is influencing the present or how unconscious conflicts are causing self-destructive behaviors. Sometimes it comes from changed behavior, such as facing phobic situations instead of avoiding them. Sometimes from testing and correcting cognitive distortions. Sometimes from emotional catharsis. Sometimes from a paradoxical injunction. And sometimes from the simple therapeutic act of validation. These are just to name a few. Corrective emotional experiences are also, of course, constantly happening as part of everyday life—a new friend or love relationship, adopting a pet, beginning an exercise regimen, getting acquainted with nature, a better job, an act of resilience in the face of stress and disappointment, or just about any other positive new experience. Therapy is just a way to increase the odds of having (or noticing) corrective emotional experiences, speeding things up, and triggering virtuous vs. vicious cycles. Too often these days, therapists adhere slavishly to one or another therapy school, and schools compete with one rather than join forces. This guild warfare is bad for psychotherapy, bad for therapists, and, most of all, bad for patients. Every therapist should have eclectic training that provides a full tool kit of techniques that promote corrective emotional experiences. No one school has a monopoly on wisdom or therapeutic power.

Is Psychotherapy Still an Infant Science?

The field of psychotherapy has been around for quite a while—well over 100 years. According to sociologists of science, a field only reaches “maturity” when there exists a consensus amongst those working in the field. Within psychotherapy, we have yet to reach that stage. Instead, psychotherapy is characterized by someone coming up with still another new form of therapy. What seems to be most revered is what is “new.” As therapy practitioners and researchers, we are therefore confronted with some important questions: Are we destined to continue to forget what we know and instead focus on what is new? Will it always be the case that we emphasize who, not what, is right? Will the field forever be characterized by “dogma eat dogma?” “Is there nothing about psychotherapy about which we can agree?

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Having spent approximately 60 years teaching, researching, supervising, and practicing psychotherapy—and ruminating all these years about these questions—I believe that one day we will have answers to them. In the meantime, where do we stand? I would suggest that there are indeed a few things we have learned over the years from the convergence of both clinical observation and psychotherapy research that can provide a crude, if not basic understanding of a few points of agreement.

To begin with, if we step back and temporarily set aside our theoretical perspectives, it might be possible to say that most (all?) therapies proceed along somewhat similar stages of change. If effective, therapeutic change progresses as follows:

1. Unconscious Incompetence
2. Conscious Incompetence
3. Conscious Competence
4. Unconscious Competence

What does this mean? The patient comes in and says that there's something about their life that's not working, be it relational or symptomatic, but they don't know the factors that are contributing to this lack of effectiveness or incompetence. Thus, they are in an initial phase of unconscious incompetence.

As a result of the therapy—either what occurs in session or between-session self-observations—patients become more aware of the thoughts, actions, and/or emotions that may be creating problems in their life and contributing to their lack of competence. They may be misinterpreting what other people's motives are; not recognizing how their actions may be having a negative impact on others; becoming angry over not getting what they want instead of asking for something directly; and a host of other factors that are uncovered over the course of therapy. There are numerous ways that patients can come to understand why things are not working for them. Through the methods used to come to this understanding, they are now in the phase of conscious incompetence.

Becoming better aware of the reasons for their lack of effectiveness/competence may then lead to the need to function in a different way, taking into account those factors that are causing the lack of their intrapersonal or interpersonal competence. It is then that patients need to make deliberate efforts to behave, think, and/or feel differently: conscious competence.

If the therapy is successful, and over a period of time they benefit from numerous instances of corrective experiences, patients’ conscious competence may become more automatic, resulting in the final phase of unconscious competence.

In order to move patients through these phases, there are certain transtheoretical principles that cut across different schools of therapy.

  • To begin with, our patients need to have some degree of positive expectation and motivation that therapy will help. The most effective of therapies will not do anything if the patient's negative expectations and lack of motivation causes them to do nothing—or to terminate.
  • There also needs to be the presence of an optimal therapeutic alliance. Much has been written about this, and there's both research evidence and clinical observations that this is an important transtheoretical principle.
  • Helping patients to become better aware of themselves and their world can be implemented clinically in varying ways, depending on one’s theoretical approach and individualized case formulation.
  • A most important principle of change involves encouraging the patient to try out new ways of functioning—corrective experiences—that help them become more effective emotionally, cognitively and behaviorally in their lives.
  • Over the course of effective therapy, there develops a synergistic reciprocity of having corrective experiences that enhances patients’ awareness resulting in an ongoing reciprocity between corrective experiences and increased awareness—a form of ongoing reality testing.

The following is a graphic depiction of the how transtheoretical principles of change articulate with the transtheoretical stages of change in therapy:

None of this says anything about the specific techniques that different schools of therapy may use to implement the strategic principles, nor does it say anything about the overarching theoretical interpretation of why the interventions may work. At the level of abstraction that I have proposed, it clearly does not say it all. Still, it can provide the foundation for practice, training and research.
For those interested in learning more about this topic, I have written elsewhere on the topic. You can find these articles listed below.
__________

I would appreciate it if you could take this very brief survey (approximately 5 minutes) about transtheoretical principles of change: Please click here.

__________

Obtaining consensus in psychotherapy: What holds us back?American Psychologist, Issue 74, pages 484-496
Consensus in psychotherapy: Are we there yet? Clinical Psychology: Science and Practice, Issue 28, pages 267-276

Relief or Change? Which is the Most Meaningful?

Jack, a forty-three-year-old insurance executive, was referred to me by his family doctor for help with severe panic attacks that had suddenly begun for reasons that were completely unclear to both of them. Jack's symptoms were disabling and resulted in his missing work for several days before his initial appointment with me.

In the first session, I listened to him describe his difficult breathing, chest pains, sleeplessness, occasional choking episodes, along with his fear of losing complete control and “going crazy.” He told me that he has always been an anxious person and had contemplated entering psychotherapy for several years, but never actually did…until now.

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The initial consultation with Jack was, in my view, a mixed success. According to Jack however, it was “an unbelievable success.” We were able to quickly identify the sources of his current anxiety symptoms, which almost immediately provided him with some much-needed relief. We began to outline some of the likely goals of the ongoing therapy he was “very happy to be starting, finally,” and for which he eagerly arranged his next appointment with me.

As the session wore on, I began to feel concerned that the initial and speedy benefits of this first session might have implications for Jack's ability to fully engage in the challenging, ongoing work of psychotherapy, something I believed he needed and from which he could derive greater benefit than immediate symptom relief only. I became especially concerned when Jack described his first session as “maybe the best hour of my life!” and described me as “undoubtedly, the best therapist in America!” That's when I thought, I probably will never see Jack again.

As it turned out, Jack did attend his second session, and a third, and described the continuing benefits of the work thus far. He was hardly symptomatic, felt “great,” no longer thought that he was “losing it,” and was wondering whether or not he really needed therapy after all. Somewhat surprisingly, he asked me to tell him what I thought he should do. In order to help Jack figure this out for himself as much as possible, I did what any therapist worth their stripes would likely do as a first response to such a question: I asked Jack to try and decide independently of my input, so that we could both learn something about his attitudes, thoughts, and feelings, rather than have him simply react to mine. My input followed and consisted of my ideas about the differences between relief and change, with the latter, obviously, being the more ambitious pursuit and perhaps the more durable. I also was mindful, as always, that for some people, relief may be all they want or need. Not everyone wishes to or has the wherewithal to undertake a full course of psychotherapy, especially if they are not in active distress.

After a meaningful conversation about his dilemma, i.e. to stay or to go, Jack decided that he was quite happy with what had occurred and chose not to pursue further therapy at the time. He asked for and received assurance that my door would always be open, and we both acknowledged that we may or may not ever see each other again. He left describing himself as the “three-session wonder.” I later heard from his physician that he was doing quite well, with no further panic attacks. It led me to wonder whether or not I should revise my thinking to include the fact that sometimes and for some people, relief is change, and not necessarily something less or less meaningful.

Snatching Defeat from the Jaws of Victory

After several tries, Jim, age twenty-five, was finally accepted into a prestigious bank management program. Once in the program, however, Jim found it difficult to make time to study. Assignments were handed in late, if even completed at all, and Jim developed severe headaches, all of which eventually led to his being the only trainee to leave the program, just days before he would have been forced to withdraw.

Alice, a first-year student in the Ph.D. program in psychology at a northern university had a similar experience. An otherwise unusually hard working and effective person, she found it easier to help others than to help herself. A cherished friend, colleague, and fellow student, Alice consistently failed to handle the demands of the graduate program, despite a well-demonstrated ability for academic work. While ably helping fellow students with their work, she neglected or mishandled her own papers, and her presentations were neglected to the point where her status in the program became jeopardized.

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Both Jim and Alice exhibit a pattern of self-defeating behaviors—clusters of thoughts, ideas and actions that sabotage success at work and in relationships. Self-defeating behaviors include a broad spectrum of self-imposed handicaps and other ploys and tactics that may suggest emotional trouble. Simply stated, a self-defeating behavior is any behavior that keeps someone from reaching their goals or sabotages their ability to be successful in ways that matter to them.

The obvious questions that arise in situations like these are “Why exactly do these people become their own worst enemies?” and “What would make bright, upwardly mobile, and ambitious individuals self-sabotage?”

Many explanations have been proposed for these behaviors. The most traditional analysis claims that people who repeatedly “shoot themselves in the foot” fear success, feel guilty about their behavior, or simply suffer from low self-esteem. Other explanations include the possibility that self-defeatists have inflated opinions of themselves, and that they use self-defeat to take control of a fear of failure. Perhaps Jim had serious doubts about his ability to successfully make it through the bank management program, so his being “too busy” to find the time to study, as well as his headaches, provided excuses that justified his exit without having to risk failing in the actual program.

Alice might have been handling her anxieties about the graduate program by developing a praiseworthy excuse for her own self-doubts and conflicts about her performance. If her sacrifices on behalf of her fellow students led to her inability to successfully complete the program, she could take comfort in the belief that she would have succeeded if only she would have finished. Her self-defeating handicap protected her from the risk of failure.

I have had success working with self-defeating individuals like Jim and Alice by helping them to learn to reflect rather than react and by identifying the negative self-beliefs that were partly responsible for their propensity to self-sabotage. With Alice, these beliefs caused low expectations for success and, hence, little motivation to try for better performance in future endeavors. This precipitated additional failure and helped to create a cycle of self-defeating behaviors for which she constructed defenses (e.g. rationalization) as her only means of coping. Therapy consisted of eliminating the irrational negative beliefs associated with self-defeat and replacing them with positive and rational alternative ones that she could gradually accept as valid. In addition, Alice was encouraged to consider alternative explanations for her failures. This was accomplished by considering hypothetical explanations for various events in which she was unable to succeed. With Jim, we were able to shift his attribution for failure from his claim that he lacked the ability to succeed to the realization that his failure in the bank management program had more to do with his insufficient effort. This enabled him to develop an expectation of possible success and helped him to imagine that he could, in fact, succeed if he was willing to try, and try differently, a second time.

A question that has had a great deal of traction with clients like Alice and Jim has been, “If you could do this over again, what would you do differently?” This helps them to begin a conversation that allows them to consider a different pathway, one that takes them to success rather than defeat.The satisfaction I was able to enjoy with both Jim and Alice had a great deal to do with their ability to tolerate the insights that illuminated their histories of self-defeat.

Gradually, they were able to relinquish the distorted beliefs and rationalizations that camouflaged and perpetuated their self-sabotage. Both of them were good examples of how insights become a blueprint for change in the course of a psychotherapeutic experience. Too often, the people I work with become "insight rich and change poor," which is why, for some, therapy feels moderately helpful, but not sufficiently productive and fulfilling. Good therapy has both therapist and client keeping a careful eye on the extent to which insights are implemented and identifiable and measurable change is able to occur.